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SonofShadow Said: First the USA was founded on the principles of the Bible and on the fact that Jesus Christ was God among us and came to earth to provide a way for us to be reconciled to Him.

In His honor we established the United States of America.

Freedom of religion at that time meant that we could worship Jesus as we saw fit, without the State mandating a certain way.

The Jews were included in this, even though they do not believe that Jesus is Lord because historically, they are Gods chosen people. We as Christians are commanded by God to support and love them. They will be reconciled to him in time, and will eventually come to a saving knowledge of Jesus the Christ.

No other religions were even considered because they aren’t relevant.

Also, our laws were directly based on The Ten Commandments.

Sorry Sir, but I believe this is a common misunderstanding about the start of our country. Here’s a few quotes for you to consider.

“Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we called it the word of a demon, than the word of God. It is a history of wickedness, that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind.” - Thomas Paine (The Age of Reason, 1794-1795.)

“I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of… Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all.”- Thomas Paine (The Age of Reason, 1794-1795.)

“Is uniformity attainable? Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error
all over the earth.” - Thomas Jefferson (Notes on Virginia, 1782; from George Seldes, ed., The Great Quotations, Secaucus, New Jersey: Citadel Press, 1983, p. 363.)

And many more found here. I will grant you that there were some founding fathers that were Christian, others were deists, but above all they were secularists. They knew the importance of freedom of religion. Now, most people would say, “Exactly, freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion.” Which sounds like a nice catch phrase until you think about it. But what is NOT having freedom of religion? Being forced to recognize a religion in which you don’t believe? To go to school which sponsors and regularly supports only one religion? To be tried in a court of law in which only one religion and it’s laws are considered? In order for me to have MY freedom of MY religion, I have to have freedom FROM YOUR religion first.

In regards to your comment about our laws being taken from the Ten Commandments, let’s look at them:

“And God spoke all these words, saying: ‘I am the LORD your God…

ONE: ‘You shall have no other gods before Me.‘

TWO: ‘You shall not make for yourself a carved image–any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.‘

THREE: ‘You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.‘

FOUR: ‘Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.‘

FIVE: ‘Honor your father and your mother.‘

SIX: ‘You shall not murder.‘

SEVEN: ‘You shall not commit adultery.‘

EIGHT: ‘You shall not steal.‘

NINE: ‘You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.‘

TEN: ‘You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.‘

I only see two there that are laws, thou shalt not murder and thou shalt not steal. Wouldn’t we have come to this conclusion with our without Yahweh? I mean there are societies out there that have these laws without even knowing about the Bible or Jesus? What about ancient societies that had these laws before hand. I think at some point in our history we could have gotten together and said, you know what… how about you don’t steal my shit and I won’t steal your shit and while we’re at it, let’s not kill each other either.

There are many studies that can show how humans gained their morality and it’s not from the Bible. Unless you’re okay with slavery, stoning of unruly children, or just about any other immoral behavior sanctioned by the bible. Christians today pick and choose what to believe. They really like that whole “love thy neighbor part” but then just kinda look away at that “stoning of women on their father’s front steps if they’re found not to be a virgin on their wedding night.” Either it’s all the holy word of the God Almighty, or it’s not. Which is it?

SonofShadow Said: In the incredible prosperity to follow, (God prospers people who recognize him and seek his will) the world witnessed the power of God.

Anyone who beheld this naturally wanted a part of it.

Immigrants came first with respect and reverence for our ways and wanted to learn how to do it like us, since our way worked better than theirs.

Today, they come like jealous, power hungry monkeys who don’t understand the principles behind what they see, invading the tents of the far more advanced humans and attempting to use their implements with only limited success.

They could become like the humans if they wanted to though, but man is a self willed and stiff-necked creature.

I think a lot of our success has to do with the fact that we allowed freedom of religion and allowed people of all cultures to come here and start new. They were able to escape the oppressive religious nations that they were from.

SonofShadow Said: Of course the moral deterioration of our own people is the most hastening factor leading us to decline.

I also disagree on our “moral deterioration”. Yes, I would say that in some aspects of society we’re what some would call less moral. But then again, that’s YOUR morality. What you perceive as morally wrong I might not. I’m for legalized prostitution and if I remember our discussions on the night crew, you were too. I know a lot of people would say that we’re immoral for having that view. However, we have good secular reasons as to why we think that it should be legalized.

We’ve abolished slavery, Women can vote, We’ve had a civil rights movement… Overall I’d say our society’s morals have improved… again, overall.

SonofShadow Said: Fifty or so years ago in this country we respected God on an almost universal level.

Today that respect has given way to relativism, modernism, and post modernism where the foolish notion that there is no absolute right or wrong is paraded around like they were doing in Sodom and Gomorrah before they found themselves on the business end of some fire and brimstone.

Again, There are many secular reasons for the development of our morals. Your suggestion of an “absolute right and wrong” just doesn’t hold water. If it’s God, why are you working on Sunday? More importantly, why aren’t you killing people who work on Sunday?

SonofShadow Said: If you were to ask me to describe in one word who is responsible for the decline of The United States of America…

CHRISTIANS.

Yes, the very people who did it right in the beginning have become apathetic, lazy, self absorbed, and selfish. This has allowed all sorts of screwball ideas to permeate our great society.

Cocooned in our prosperity, with more security than ever to shield us from the consequences of our actions, we entertain all sorts of stupidity as never before in history.

We accept and tolerate all sorts of detrimental thought and behavior as never before in ANY successful society let alone our own.

On behalf of myself and other Christians here in The U.S., I apologize for getting your hopes up.

You might as well go back to where you came from.

While you perceive this as a bad thing, I perceive it as a good thing. I respect your right to practice your religion, but I do not respect the attempts to make this country a theocracy. It sure as shit hasn’t served the middle east very well